Originally Posted by ✰ Sparkles ✰ View Post
@VIP_FAKEER can we please have a healthy discussion & not use foul language for one another????
When someone loses his cool it means he's lost d argument. He hates me coz he is beginning to agree with me.
I never lost any argument from you and even you know that. I always put a lid on your dirty hole with proper meaning and references from Gurubani. Even you know what and so does everyone else on this site. So eh tainu vi patah kis nu mooh di pendi si
Waheguru Mantar in Bhai Gurdas's Vaar is only saying that waheguru (God) has always pervading & was omnipresent in all yugs. How can a Sikh Say that Guru Nanak is Avatar of Kaliyuga in his poetry without using the references of other Yugs & other Avtar's for people to really understand the meaning of Waheguru?
VA is for Satyuga
HE is for Duwapar
GU is for Trehta
RU is for Kalyug
Thats all he is saying. He is saying that In Satyuga people chanted Vishnu. In duwapar Hari Krishna, in Treta, Raam and in Kalyug Govind is recited. But When you say Waheguru, you remember the God that was present before those yugs, during those yugs and now in Kaliyuga. Instead of remembering individual Avatar, thus dividing the creator, by saying Vaheguru you remember the Creator who created these Avtaars.
Samaj Lag gayi
੪੯ : ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂ ਮੰਤ੍ਰ
ਸਤਿਜੁਗ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਵਾਸਦੇਵ ਵਵਾ ਵਿਸਨਾ ਨਾਮੁ ਜਪਾਵੈ।
Satijougi Satigur Vaasadayv Vavaa Visanaa Naamu Japaavai.
सतिजुगि सतिगुर वासदेव ववा विसना नामु जपावै ।
In Satyug, Visnu in the form of Vasudev is said to have incarnated and ‘V’ Of Vahiguru reminds of Visnu.
ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂ ਸਬਦ ਦਾ ਅੰਨ੍ਵਯ ਚਾਰੇ ਜੁਗਾਂ ਨਾਲ ਕੀਤਾ ਜਾਂਦਾ ਹੈ:-ਸਤਿਜੁਗ ਵਿਖੇ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਨਾਨਕ ਜੀ ਵਾਸਦੇਵ ਦਾ ਅਵਤਾਰ ਹੋਏ, ਉਥੋਂ ਵਵਾ ਲੀਤਾ, ਵਿਸ਼ਨੂੰ ਦਾ ਨਾਮ (ਲੋਕ) ਜਪਣ ਲੱਗੇ।
1 ਵਾਰਾਂ ਭਾਈ ਗੁਰਦਾਸ : ਵਾਰ ੧ ਪਉੜੀ ੪੯ ਪੰ. ੧
ਦੁਆਪੁਰਿ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਹਰੀ ਕ੍ਰਿਸਨ ਹਾਹਾ ਹਰਿ ਹਰਿ ਨਾਮੁ ਜਪਾਵੈ।
Duaapari Satigur Haree Krisan Haahaa Hari Hari Naamu Japaavai.
दुआपरि सतिगुर हरी क्रिसन हाहा हरि हरि नामु जपावै ।
The true Guru of dvapar is said to be Harikrsna and ‘H’ of Vahiguru reminds of Hari.
(ਫੇਰ) ਦੁਆਪਰ (ਵਿਖੇ) ਸਤਿਗੁਰੂ (ਨਾਨਕ ਜੀ) ਹਰੀ (ਅਰਥਾਤ) ਕ੍ਰਿਸ਼ਨ (ਦਾ ਰੂਪ) ਹੋਏ, ਹਾਹਾ (ਅੱਖਰ ਲੀਤਾ) ਹਰਿ ਹਰਿ ਦਾ ਨਾਮ ਜਪਣ ਲੱਗੇ।
2 ਵਾਰਾਂ ਭਾਈ ਗੁਰਦਾਸ : ਵਾਰ ੧ ਪਉੜੀ ੪੯ ਪੰ. ੨
ਤ੍ਰੇਤੇ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਰਾਮ ਜੀ ਰਾਰਾ ਰਾਮ ਜਪੇ ਸੁਖੁ ਪਾਵੈ।
Taytay Satigur Raam Jee Raaraa Raam Japay Soukhu Paavai.
तेते सतिगुर राम जी रारा राम जपे सुखु पावै ।
In the the treta was Ram and ‘R’ of Vahiguru tells that rembering Ram will produce joy and happiness.
ਤ੍ਰੇਤੇ (ਯੁਗ ਵਿਖੇ) ਸਤਿਗੁਰੂ (ਨਾਨਕ ਜੀ) ਰਾਮ ਜੀ (ਦਾ ਰੂਪ ਧਾਰਿਆ ਉਥੋਂ) ਰਾਰਾ (ਲੀਤਾ) ਰਾਮ ਰਾਮ (ਲੋਕੀਂ) ਉਚਾਰਕੇ ਸੁਖ ਪਾਉਣ ਲੱਗੇ।
3 ਵਾਰਾਂ ਭਾਈ ਗੁਰਦਾਸ : ਵਾਰ ੧ ਪਉੜੀ ੪੯ ਪੰ. ੩
ਕਲਿਜੁਗਿ ਨਾਨਕ ਗੁਰ ਗੋਵਿੰਦ ਗਗਾ ਗੋਵਿੰਦ ਨਾਮੁ ਅਲਾਵੈ*।
Kalijougi Naanak Gur Gobind Gagaa Gobind Naamu Alaavai.
ਕਲਿਯੁਗ (ਵਿਖੇ) ਗੁਰੂ ਨਾਨਕ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ (ਰੂਪ ਹੋਏ, ਲੋਕ) ਗੋਬਿੰਦ (ਗੋਬਿੰਦ) ਜਪਣ ਲੱਗੇ, (ਉਥੋਂ) ਗਗਾ (ਲੀਤਾ) ਹੈ।
कलिजुगि नानक गुर गोबिंद गगा गोबिंद नामु अलावै ।
In kalijug, Gobind is in the form of Nanak and ‘G’ of Vahiguru gets Govind recited.
4 ਵਾਰਾਂ ਭਾਈ ਗੁਰਦਾਸ : ਵਾਰ ੧ ਪਉੜੀ ੪੯ ਪੰ. ੪
ਚਾਰੇ ਜਾਗੇ ਚਹੁ ਜੁਗੀ ਪੰਚਾਇਣ ਵਿਚਿ ਜਾਇ ਸਮਾਵੈ।
Chaaray Jaagay Chahu Jougee Panchaain Vichi Jaai Samaavai.
चारे जागे चहु जुगी पंचाइण विचि जाइ समावै ।
The recitations o f all the four ages subsume in Panchayan i.e. in the soul of the common man.
ਚਹੁੰ ਜੁੱਗਾਂ ਦੇ ਚਾਰੇ (ਉਪਰ ਕਥੇ ਜਾਗੇ=) ਅਵਤਾਰ ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂ ਵਿਚ ਜਾ ਸਮਾਉਂਦੇ ਹਨ।
5 ਵਾਰਾਂ ਭਾਈ ਗੁਰਦਾਸ : ਵਾਰ ੧ ਪਉੜੀ ੪੯ ਪੰ. ੫
ਚਾਰੋ ਅਛਰ ਇਕੁ ਕਰਿ ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂ ਜਪੁ ਮੰਤ੍ਰ ਜਪਾਵੈ*।
Chaaro Achhar Iku Kari Vaahaguroo Japu Mantr Japaavai.
चारो अछर इकु करि वाहगुरू जपु मंत्र जपावै ।
When joining four letters Vahiguru is remembered,
(ਗੱਲ ਕੀ) ਚਾਰੇ ਅੱਖਰ ਕੱਠੇ ਕਰਕੇ, ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂ (ਪੰਜਵਾਂ) ਜਪ ਮੰਤ੍ਰ (ਸੰਗਤ ਨੂੰ ਗੁਰੂ ਜੀ ਨੇ) ਜਪਾਇਆ।
6 ਵਾਰਾਂ ਭਾਈ ਗੁਰਦਾਸ : ਵਾਰ ੧ ਪਉੜੀ ੪੯ ਪੰ. ੬
ਜਹਾਂ ਤੇ ਉਪਜਿਆ ਫਿਰਿ ਤਹਾਂ ਸਮਾਵੈ ॥੪੯॥੧॥
Jahaa Tay Oupajiaa Dhiri Tahaa Samaavai ॥49॥1॥
जहा ते उपजिआ फिरि तहा समावै ॥४९॥१॥
The jiv merges again in its origin.
7 ਵਾਰਾਂ ਭਾਈ ਗੁਰਦਾਸ : ਵਾਰ ੧ ਪਉੜੀ ੪੯ ਪੰ. ੭
(ਮੰਤ੍ਰ ਈਸ਼੍ਵਰ ਦੇ ਨਾਮ ਥੋਂ) ਜਿਥੋਂ ਉਪਜਿਆ ਹੈ ਫਿਰ ਉਸੇ ਵਿਖੇ ਲੀਨ ਹੋ ਜਾਂਦਾ ਹੈ। (ਧ੍ਵਨੀ ਇਹ ਕਿ ਫੇਰ ਸੰਸਾਰ ਦੀ ਪ੍ਰਾਪਤ ਨਹੀਂ ਰਹੇਗੀ ਪਰਮਪਦਦੀ ਪ੍ਰਾਪਤ ਹੋ ਜਾਵੇਗੀ। ਅਰਥਾਤ ਨਾਮ ਨਾਮੀ ਤੋਂ ਹੋਇਆ ਹੈ ਤੇ ਨਾਮੀ ਵਿਚ ਹੀ ਲੈ ਜਾਂਦਾ ਹੈ)☬ਐਉਂ ਬੀ ਅਰਥ ਲਾਉਣ ਦਾ ਜਤਨ ਹੁੰਦਾ ਹੈ: ਸਤਿਜੁਗ ਵਿਚ ਵਾਸਦੇਵ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਸੇ
As per why Kabir is not the founder of Sikhi, its not because he is a Jhulaha, or a low caste. But he had a guru..guru ramanand. Guru Nanak had only one Guru, Akal Purak and he obtained his order from Akal Purak himself to spread the word of God.
With all due respect to Kabir, he is a Sharomni Bhagat but Kabir didn't travel 120000 Km all around Asia to Spread the word of God. He always stayed in Kashi or Varanasi. He didn't leave his family, wife mata Loyi Ji. He didn't establish a Town Kartarpur and established a Nirmal Dharma of Sikhs. So this why he isn't the founder of Sikhi.
ਸੁਣੀ ਪੁਕਾਰਿ ਦਾਤਾਰ ਪ੍ਰਭੁ ਗੁਰੁ ਨਾਨਕ ਜਗ ਮਾਹਿ ਪਠਾਇਆ।
Kabir is not a Avtaar. He was first a Jagaaishu..and from there he slowly became a Sant...and than a Bhagat (Merged with one God) He took a Journey in lief.
Guru Nanak didn't. He was not a Jagaaishu but a Avataar (God himself)
It has been clear to us that the way we are 'hindu' is by geographics ..there is no mention of this word 'hindu' even in the Sanatan Shastras and Puraans so to say that anyone is a 'hindu' by religion wouldnt be correct.
Collectively, Dharam of Indian origin could be termed 'Hindu' otherwise it is always 'sanatan' . A ceoncept which kept evolving as according to the need of the time.
"My Dharma is Hindu. It is very dear to; how can I destroy it [by denying and forsaking it]? In this and
the next world, it gives comfort. There is no other to be had in comparison to it. Only a fool of impure
intellect [would forsake it]. He forsakes it he who is an enemy of Dharma."
(Kavi Santokh Singh, Suraj Parkash, ed. Bhai Vir Singh, 11: 4468-4469)
You can not copy and paste from Websites, show the original book and also the Rass from Suraj Pratap Granth which says this and then we will talk
One of the best documents about Guru Tagh Bahadur's martyrdom is the
rigorous paper by Dr. GanDa Singh, titled "Martyrdom of Guru Tegh
Bahadur" and can be found in December 1994 issues of the Sikh Review.
I recommend this paper to anyone interested in the entire series of
events that led to the martyrdom of the Guru at Delhi.
Aurangzeb was not present in Delhi at the time of Guru Tegh Bahadur's
martyrdom, but the execution of the Guru was carried out upon his
orders. In view of this, the event of dialogue with Aurangzeb
as cited by Manush is not true.
"The meaning of all this is that the true practices of the Khalsa are all not in any way opposing
the Hindu Dharma texts. They are all given testimony to and praised there. For this reason the
Khalsa is the true example of 'Sanatan' Hindus."
(Avatar Singh Vahiria, Khalsa Sudar Tru, Chapter 1, Khalsa Ateh Hindu da Nitara,
(Sant Singh Loodar oriental press, Lahore, n.d.),1:46)
Paste the whole chapter for people to read...not only one paragraph. WE cannot do synopsis by one paragraph
"I'm not selling Hinduism to anyone." Really @
Manush you are not selling Hindiusm?
You always said all Guru's are Hindus. Our Guru Granth clearly say we are hindu and here you are being a nice guy..oh I am not selling Hinduism to anyone. Why are you trying so Hard by hook or crook, by any means possible to taint sikhi and its history? Why are you getting involved and leaving harsh comments and hurting the sentiments of Sikhs? You are nothing but a double face snake spreading your venom. We never invited you to have discussions with us? Did we? No!!
If you want, we will bring our Sikh scholars and lets have proper discussion. Do not hide behind your computer chair and lets come together..prove your point in the presence of Sikh Sangat if you have your proper research.
Thats what Our Guru Nanak did. He called Babar...Jabbar. He went to all famous Hindu/Muslim Pilgrimages fearless to prove his point of One God. If you are man of God, believe God to be fearless and have something very important to say to SIKH community that they are Hindu, lets talk.
D kirpan is not a religious symbol, but a khanda is.
N d kirpan is not on d sikh nishan sahib. The Khanda is.
You are an Monkey, who jumps from one branch to another. When I answer your questions on Khanda and you know I am right, you take the discussion to a difference subject. That's what Monkeys do
Kabeer..why he isn't the founder of Sikhism
and Some other useless nonsense from website that is created by some Hindu cult.
